Turbo upgrade

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27 Apr 2018 07:55 #481 by mort
mort replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Hi All,
There has been 47 Turbos produced and still some that want either for better performance or to replace ones that are wearing out.
It appears that some have reported that when the old one is removed and checked there is signs of wear from 250,000klm to 400. That can be from over heating and/or lack of oil or just simply its worked hard.
The over heating can be fixed by installing a pyro gauge and driving within a safe temp range.
The oil can be fixed by using a good oil and changing oil and filter on a regular basis.
Working hard well congratulations you have time to use your OKA.
Martyn

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27 Apr 2018 16:04 #482 by alanj
alanj replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Hi Martin,

Is it worth listing the difference in price for the different order amounts? What is the price if there are only 3 or 4 of us? How much difference if 10 are interested?

Alan.

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28 Apr 2018 07:05 #483 by mort
mort replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Hi Alan,
The price for 10 is cullently $775.00 and for smaller numbers is $1150.00.
There is 4 wanting at the moment 1 like yourself who just purchased an OKA and 2 that dont get online often and missed out and 1 that has a turbo that needs replacing due to worn out.
Like yourself all are willing to pay the extra if we dont get the numbers up to 10.
I would think thoses that are happy with the performance as std may need to consider what are you going to do when your std turbo wears out.
I was waiting for the numbers to build up but if the need is urgent I can place an order but at the same time maybe every one that wants one has got and there wont be any more.
Martyn

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28 Apr 2018 12:04 #484 by Tony Lee
Tony Lee replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Drove from Bulahdelah to Goulburn a few days ago and thought I would take the lid off the air cleaner to see if it made any difference. Maybe a little bit nippier.

Was overtaking a semi on flat ground, no wind at 107kmph on the GPS - thanks Martin- turbo does the trick - and was up level with him when there was a hell of a bang and a very loud roaring/hissing noise.

Must have been a tyre blowing on the semi.
Nope, so it must be on my rig. WTF. Bloody turbo then - @#$&^^&*#!$# Cheap Chinese junk?? Surely not. Hope not!! Noise dropped off when I lifted my foot and came back when I planted it.????

Pulled over and looked all around. Nothing out of the ordinary. Engine idling normally. ???

So moved all the junk we keep in the centre console and had a look. Still nothing abnormal.

Finally leaned over a bit more and noticed the turbo boost transducer hanging free. Whew, not the turbo at all. I like faults that are easy to fix.

Wiggled it back in to the recommended 10mm hole and headed off again.
Happened again 10 minutes later so this time got some wire and tied it in place.

Obviously that American mob needs to redesign their mounting so it stays in place. I had added a bit of silicone as David suggested but not good enough. Could be that the nut that I drilled out is actually too thick so that the ribs of the grommet cant expand and hold it in place

Hate to think how it would stay in place with double the boost that we have. Could be that the nut that I drilled out is actually too thick so that the ribs of the grommet can't expand and hold it in place

BTW Sorry for the momentary doubt Mort. Your turbo is still great.

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28 Apr 2018 12:40 #485 by Peter and Sandra OKA 374
Peter and Sandra OKA 374 replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Ha ha BTDT, when I first put the 6bt in was giving it a bit up a hill and at 28lb boost the hose between the turbo and engine intake blew off, huge womp under the bonnet, scared the crap out of me, like you thought it was something major. Ran a bead of weld around the steel pipe on the outside and two hose clamps it hasn't moved since.

OKA 374 LT Van, converted to camper/motorhome,
400ah Lithiums, 680w solar, diesel cooking heating and HWS,
Cummins 6BT, Allison 6 speed auto, Nissan transfer.

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28 Apr 2018 16:24 #486 by dandjcr
dandjcr replied the topic: Turbo upgrade

Tony Lee wrote: there was a hell of a bang and a very loud roaring/hissing noise.

Could be that the nut that I drilled out is actually too thick so that the ribs of the grommet can't expand and hold it in place


Tony, I haven't done any road work to test mine yet but the Auber 303 manual shows the plastic moulding beneath the neoprene gasket as 7.5mm diameter so there's not a lot of diameter to play with. They recommend 10.6-10.9mm.

Its length is around 14mm and I can't recall the nut being that thick. Maybe gasket goo (Blue Max) would be better than silicon?

I shall try that plus wire (or an ali bracket off the 2 adjacent adaptor bolts) to be sure, to be sure.


David and Janet Ribbans - Oka 148
Oka148 profile here.
Visit our technical and travel blogs: here.
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28 Apr 2018 17:25 - 28 Apr 2018 17:27 #487 by Holmz
Holmz replied the topic: Turbo upgrade

Tony Lee wrote: Drove from Bulahdelah to Goulburn a few days ago and thought I would take the lid off the air cleaner to see if it made any difference. Maybe a little bit nippier.

Was overtaking a semi on flat ground, no wind at 107kmph on the GPS - thanks Martin- turbo does the trick - and was up level with him when there was a hell of a bang and a very loud roaring/hissing noise.

Must have been a tyre blowing on the semi.
Nope, so it must be on my rig. WTF. Bloody turbo then - @#$&^^&*#!$# Cheap Chinese junk?? Surely not. Hope not!! Noise dropped off when I lifted my foot and came back when I planted it.????

Pulled over and looked all around. Nothing out of the ordinary. Engine idling normally. ???

So moved all the junk we keep in the centre console and had a look. Still nothing abnormal.

Finally leaned over a bit more and noticed the turbo boost transducer hanging free. Whew, not the turbo at all. I like faults that are easy to fix.

Wiggled it back in to the recommended 10mm hole and headed off again.
Happened again 10 minutes later so this time got some wire and tied it in place.

Obviously that American mob needs to redesign their mounting so it stays in place. I had added a bit of silicone as David suggested but not good enough. Could be that the nut that I drilled out is actually too thick so that the ribs of the grommet cant expand and hold it in place

Hate to think how it would stay in place with double the boost that we have. Could be that the nut that I drilled out is actually too thick so that the ribs of the grommet can't expand and hold it in place

BTW Sorry for the momentary doubt Mort. Your turbo is still great.


Mate,

I have some stainless versions of zip-ties to hold some fibreglass/Kevlar wrap around the exhausts to contain heat and help the turbo spool,faster (which is clearly a bit of a wank, but they look pretty cool).
PM if you want one posted to help hold in the sensor... but wire does basically the same...

I went with a different Auber sensor with a smaller diameter to aid in holding onto the sensor.
Hopefully they will front up in the post next week.


That thing should have been whistling like Jimminy Cricket once it blew out...
Last Edit: 28 Apr 2018 17:27 by Holmz.

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29 Apr 2018 09:02 #488 by mort
mort replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Hi Tony,
My first reactoin when reading was concern as the turbo goes through a testing process before leaving factory so what could be wrong then I got half way and started reading again in case I missed something then read to the end.
I built up this picture of you overtaking a truck like never before and feeling very smug then bang, after getting over a near heart attack cursing the hell out of me and the turbo, sorry but I had a good laugh at the thought.
Martyn

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29 Apr 2018 09:10 #489 by mort
mort replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Hi All,
I had a call from some one yesterday wanting to know if I can get a turbo for a 6bt as they have the one that came with the engine and yes I can.
I did enquire just in case and it is a std item for them and the price is about the same as for the Perkins the only question they asked was what H/power do you want.
Martyn

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30 Apr 2018 05:53 #490 by Ralley
Ralley replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
They came out with a fair few variations depending on the application, some are more tuneable than others.
Martin it might be worth talking to a guy in Perth, Graeme from Gturbo he really knows his stuff and may have some great advise on what would work best. He specialises in Toyota and Nissan stuff but his understanding of turbo's is amazing. I run one of his Turbo's on my Landcruiser and the way it performs is awesome. I recently visited him to get my cruiser tuned and they had just taken a cruiser of the dyno with the 1HDfte that had been stroked to 4.5L it had just made 310KW at the wheels. He took me for a drive and the way this thing drove was remarkable there was pretty much no lag. The bottom end performance was unbelievable. This cruiser has since made 510KW on the Dyno with methanol and a squirt of nitrous. He builds his own turbo's and obviously really understands how to get the flow right. He may be able to point you in the right direction as to what might work best.

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01 May 2018 06:11 #491 by Alister McBride
Alister McBride replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Geez a cruiser with 310kW and here i am going to be happy upgrading from about 80kW to 170kW pulling 4-8t, maybe i should turn up the fuel screw a bit??!! B) :evil:

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01 May 2018 07:08 #492 by mort
mort replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Hi Ralley,
Sounds good and yes his premises are not far from me I do know them but I wasn't thinking of a race Oka it was more if some one had a 160hp and wanted to go up to say 220 or so or a bit better boost at lower rev or just a new turbo and when their turbos start at over $3000 + + then there is all that extra strain on the drive line you have to be keen.
Martyn

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01 May 2018 08:37 #493 by Ralley
Ralley replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
The point was not to build a racing OKA, the fact that he can manage to build a turbo that allows that type of performance and still boost really low says a lot about his understanding of what works. He might have some good advice on what wheels to use to get boost down low. I spoke to him about the cummins when I was there but only in regards as to what he could supply. If I was going to replace my turbo on the cummins with a known brand I would defiantly get his advice on what he thinks would work best in regards to size and ratios. When I did replace my turbo a couple of years back I found it a bit of a mine field because the Americans want max HP not lowdown HP.
Extra strain on an already stretched drivetrain is a problem.
Rob

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01 May 2018 15:25 #494 by Alister McBride
Alister McBride replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Hi guys, i never try to poke fun etc i was merely imagining an oka with the same power to weight ratio as that cruiser! My god, 600-800 odd Hp in a big square metal box which handles like one... even that cruiser would be a handful!

And yes, back on topic, he sounds like a great resource for turbo selection. I'd be surprised if a good solution would be too much different to the standard HX35W on the cummins as it's quite a small turbine (ie spools quickly) with quite a large compressor (comparatively). So, the turbine spools up quickly with a large compressor which gets boost up quickly (for a standard setup anyway) and then (as you probably know!) the idea of the wastegate is to keep that high initial boost constant over the rev range so it doesn't go bonkers higher up! It is actually what a lot of USA guys do, in doing a few very simple and cheap mods to the fuel pump (p-pump anyway, that's what i've been researching) which gives you more fuel down low (more axle twisting torque!) and close off the wastegate which gives you more boost through most of the rev range. This isn't why i upgraded my diffs a few years back, with the cummins bowl twisting torque in mind... it was more just the standard torque i was thinking about.

cheers, alister

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02 May 2018 05:53 #495 by mort
mort replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Hi Rob,
I understand what you are saying and I am not unfamilier with turbo's but when I had said I can get turbo's for cummins it was more for the ones that may be installing say generator engines converted to vehicle use and needed a different turbo as the turbo for a generator is not really suited or those that are using an engine that already has a few klm's on them may want to use a new turbo as I would think that going from 110hp to say 220hp would give enough of an increase to satisfy.
Martyn

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02 May 2018 06:03 #496 by mort
mort replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Hi Alister,
No offence taken and yes for an oka there is that point where too much power can make it a difficult and unsafe vehicle in the wrong hands.
Martyn

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02 May 2018 17:03 #497 by Ralley
Ralley replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
I think those sorts of hands should maybe stay away from an OKA. I've found that a fully loaded OKA with a whole lot more power is far safer than the standard 110hp. The ability to flow with the traffic and pass safely even on a hill ( a lot of the passing lanes) and then the ability to pass a 4 trailer road train with power to spare is much less stressful. It was once said that corners come a whole lot faster, which they do. The great thing about that is now I can slow down for that fast approaching corner knowing that I can accelerate back up to speed before lunch. What I found before is that I wasn't slowing down as much as I should because once it was wound up I needed a good reason to put my foot on the brake. I find the the same on dirt you can slow down a speed up to better suit the conditions and I find I'm easier on the gear because of that. When I have to cover 4000km's to pick up group I can do this in less than 4 days without being exhausted. With the perkins I would have struggled to do that legally and that doesn't even count the endless gear changes.
If you can supply a turbo for either engine that makes it more drivable you are on a winner. I think the biggest thing to consider with the Cummins is to get maximum boost in as early as you can to keep the EGT's in check. I'll be interested to see what you come up with.
Keep up the good work Martyn
Rob
The following user(s) said Thank You: DarrenWebster303

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02 May 2018 17:33 #498 by Alister McBride
Alister McBride replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Good points Ralley, a lot of what you just said makes sense and i didn't realise it's actually how i drive a lot of the time (when i'm not towing the excavator!). Trying to get speed down a hill and keep it going up to avoid gear changes. When i'm towing the excavator i've got to go slow no matter what, for safety reasons... I'll be interested to see the changes once i've upgraded. And yes, that much power in silly hands wouldn't go well, although i haven't met many oka owners like that! (maybe i just haven't met many oka owners! ;) )

Martyn, you've been doing a great job sourcing parts so far and yes even a replacement stock turbo would probably be welcome... and if this mate of yours Ralley can tweak the specs on the turbo a bit i'm sure people would welcome it!

cheers, alister

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03 May 2018 06:14 #499 by Peter and Sandra OKA 374
Peter and Sandra OKA 374 replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Our genset 6BT came with a HX35 turbo, just doesn't have a wastegate but it seems to work fine with boost starting at not much above idle and peaking at 28lb at about 2500 rpm.
The auto does allow it to boost earlier as the torque converter allows the engine revs to build before starting to push.
We've been travelling down through the back roads through the high country over the last few days and it has been interesting how much difference diesel from different outlets makes.
At home I usually fill with Caltex as that is cheapest in town, travelling down I filled (from empty) with Metro at Raymond Terrace and topped up again at a Metro in Canberra, while it seemed to go ok EGT's seemed higher and I had to back off on a few long climbs to keep EGT's down. Yesterday we filled up with Caltex again in Mansfield and the difference in power, smoothness and lower EGT's was very noticeable, I also suspect that it is using less fuel with the (slightly) more expensive Caltex diesel.

OKA 374 LT Van, converted to camper/motorhome,
400ah Lithiums, 680w solar, diesel cooking heating and HWS,
Cummins 6BT, Allison 6 speed auto, Nissan transfer.

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11 May 2018 12:36 #500 by mort
mort replied the topic: Turbo upgrade
Hi All,
5 owners are wanting new Turbo,s and 2 are urgent due to wear so if any one else wants let me know as they do realise that a small order will cost more but if we can get the numbers up it will be better for all.
Martyn

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