Starter Motor
- Outback Jack
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I have rewired the electrics in OKA for the start circuit etc.
Msin reason was that once the OKA was up to operating temp, it would be hard to start and required both batteries to start. Even then it was a hit and miss. It happend on the weekend, even on daul batteries it wouldnt start. It was turning over ok enough, but still needed a jump start from another vehicle.
With the rewire including earths etc its a little better. But still had to switch to dual batteries this afternoon. It turns over ok, maybe a little slow, then it will slow down like a flat battery, then switching to both batteries, it will start.
Batteries was new about 4 months ago.
So I am thinking it may be the starter motor, there is a lot of oil around it. I dont know its age. Its Nipponso geared type. The only other thing I can think of is maybe its low in compression, making it harder to start when warm.
Any clues????
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- Craig Bowey
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- TH
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Do you have an earth lead straight to the starter OBJ?
Cheers, Tony
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- Hank Onthewater
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There may be a secondary problem, electrical. Yes, this could be excessive voltage drop (wiring and/or connections), starter-motor itself, or even the alternator: batteries not charged enough.
Hmmm, did you have an add-on charging setup installed? Maybe that is malfunctioning, or causing charging problems, rather than improving it.
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- dandjcr
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Outback Jack wrote: But still had to switch to dual batteries this afternoon. It turns over ok, maybe a little slow, then it will slow down like a flat battery, then switching to both batteries, it will start.
OBJ, causes of this could be:
Hank is correct, if the fuel/air/mechanical systems are OK the engine should start when rotated. Has it always been this way or is the problem developing?
Suggest you recheck all the connections first, then the starter motor. Borrowing a spare to replace it with temporarily would eliminate one source of problems.
Alternatively, with a known good external battery on the ground and a pair of jumper leads, make connections direct from the battery to the starter motor frame and main terminal (ie the one from the existing battery). That will bypass all the heavy current connections.
David and Janet Ribbans - Oka 148
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- Outback Jack
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Batteries are new, however I will get them load tested. I dont think it will be them, as it does it warm not cold.
Cables/Earth. Due to having the stroke, I cant get down and dirty as much. However I have installed a earth direct from starter bolt mounting bolt to starting battery. Also new cable from starter to battery changeover switch. I also have replaced battery switch with a new one..
I thought if diesels are down on compression they can be harder to start.
Looks like I will have to fork out the 500 dollars for a starter and see what happens then. Or maybe get Auto electrician to strip current one down and rebuild it.
When I have come across this in the past, it has normally been a earth fault or cable fault. But this all has been checked, with some replaced/
Cheers
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- dandjcr
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Outback Jack wrote: Or maybe get Auto electrician to strip current one down and rebuild it.
Suggest you get it checked out before forking out wads of cash on a new starter (shouldn't cost $500 though, less than $400).
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- Outback Jack
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Sorry I was including freight etc etc.
Auto Sparky told that it was a good brand, Nipondenso is what I think he mentioned it was. He did say it was rebuildable where others where not.
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- TH
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Try running jumper lead from battery to starter as an alternative earth and vise versa with positive to solenoid.
I have a couple of vehicles with the same problem and it is doing my head in trying to pinpoint the cause
Cheers, Tony
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- Peter334
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- Outback Jack
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Here is a picture of current starter.
Its been cleaned up outside, and a new bigger cable up to battery selector switch.
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- Peter334
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- Outback Jack
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So what is the best starter then? There appears to be several options
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- TH
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Cheers, Tony
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- Outback Jack
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The orginal wiring had two fusable links from the alternator to the starter motor post, then out to the batteries.
This caused a few problems, and it all has been removed. Charging is done with a smart charger at the moment.
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- dandjcr
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Outback Jack wrote: So what is the best starter then? There appears to be several options
OBJ, when our Iskra starter failed in 2011 it turned out to be a winding fault on the rotor winding on the armature, probably a shorted turn due to overheating, and it would rotate slowly when out on the bench but wouldn't turn the engine.
I managed to find a spare s/h starter which had a different failure and rebuilt a working unit from the parts. I searched the universe in vain for a replacement armature to reassemble the remaining parts as a spare.
The features you need for the starter are, Perkins mount, 10 tooth, CW drive, and a 12v, 2.8 or 3kw power rating.
Even then there are options of direct drive or reduction gear drive. The latter is lighter, has more torque but turns more slowly. I've never tried one but others have them, I'm happy with direct drive and our Oka starts first turn, every time.
The orientation of the starter solenoid can also vary. Ours was very close to the exhaust pipe, which might have lead to early solenoid failure, but the s/h frame I used has the solenoid below the motor, more exposed to the elements but away from the exhaust.
A couple of possibilities I came across during my search (and I'm still looking for a potential replacement) are the Iskra (now called Letrika) IM315 and IM527 . I didn't find a Bosch equivalent but there may well be one.
Also this from Auto Electrics Australia .
JAS Oceania and Ashdown Ingram would be worth a call too.
There are some Chinese equivalents available from the " Ningbo Hi-Tech Altering Motor Co " but I don't know of a supplier.
David and Janet Ribbans - Oka 148
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- Outback Jack
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- Alister McBride
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Good luck!
Cheers, Alister
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- Outback Jack
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- dandjcr
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Even if not, they are worth a look. They sell a large range of electrical gear including starters and alternators. My bugbear is that they don't have an Adelaide outlet but I have had good service from them and their site has a lot of useful info.
David and Janet Ribbans - Oka 148
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