Autos verse manual trans

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11 Jun 2013 16:03 #1 by Peter334
Peter334 created the topic: Autos verse manual trans
Another good weekend weather wise and the beach was the way to go everthing was fine she ran well as the roads to the 90 mile beach is hilly the gear changing some time drives you nuts for the ratio of this gear box is not that good , the wife and I thought and auto would be better less leg work so that brings me to ask whom has put an auto behind their perky and to what benefits is there , i have always like manuals but and auto might be the right way to go for the wife and me .so what type of auto ,trans, and bits and pieces needed to change , our gear box has only done about 25k and will sell it with and 2nd one ,also transfere case too [Rockwell] . cheers peter

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11 Jun 2013 17:49 #2 by Outback Jack
Outback Jack replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
Hi Peter,

There is a report under the listings for a 4l80e conversion. Think it was around 10k in parts. This was new transmission, GU Patrol Transfer case etc.

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11 Jun 2013 20:51 #3 by TH
TH replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
I like the sound of an auto for consistent power in heavy going. Never had an auto 4wd. I've driven a few and they seem to go well in the sand.
I've driven #260 and that feels like it would perform very well in soft sand, not withstanding the 360 odd horsepower up the front :D.

Saying that, with the 135Ti I don't change gears to often on the open road. Drove to Perth and back (800kms) and didn't drop back from 5th gear once. My concern is slipping the clutch on take off and gear changes in soft sand.


I'll be watching any auto conversions with interest

Cheers, Tony
The following user(s) said Thank You: Tim R

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12 Jun 2013 06:29 #4 by OKABloke
OKABloke replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
I have a 6 Speed Allison Automatic with an Arens Push button Controller backed up with a Nissan Patrol Transfer box. This combination can go behind a Perkins for similar money to a 4L80e,
Your biggest issue with an Allison 1000 or the 4L80e will be the overall length, the Automatics are longer and rear tail shaft angles are likely to be an issue however there are ways around this.
Driving the Auto OKA is fantastic, No stress driving, instant get up and go, and really nice to reverse.

For Sale:
XT and LT Parts and Service Manuals Available on CD. $150.00 Delivered
### OKA Manuals Now Available as a Download ###.

20mm Spring Hanger Pin Upgrade Kits.

David

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12 Jun 2013 06:59 #5 by Outback Jack
Outback Jack replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
I thought the Allison would be double than a 4l80e, have to see what price a Allison is from the states. If my memory serves me right, the tranny was around 10 to 15k alone locally. But, I may be thinking of something else.

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12 Jun 2013 20:42 #6 by Joseph Baz
Joseph Baz replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
I first drove an auto 4x4 some 30 years ago on a trip to the US and it was an instant love affair,the vehicle behaves really different,on those days we didn't have any autos in oz,except from the Australian pioneer of 4x4trucks,Robert Whitehead and the RFW,we had a 4x4 RFW with a 6V71Detroit Diesel and Allison auto as a tipper and that was unstoppable a really great truck and like the Oka most people didn't appreciate the product.
Personally I don't believe that a Allison will be good behind a Perkins as the inner workings of the 4L80 and the Allison are different,The 4L80 seems to work quite happily with low power engines better than Allison specially with a paddle shifter when you can dictate the shifting pattern,also the 4L80have the controllers readily available to couple to most engines off the shelf,5speed controllers for A re also readily available and I doubt that a Perkins will hold the 6th gear for any period of time.
All in all I won't be driving a manual 4x4 in the near future.
Cheers,Joe

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14 Jun 2013 08:56 - 14 Jun 2013 09:00 #7 by dandjcr
dandjcr replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans

Joseph Baz wrote: All in all I won't be driving a manual 4x4 in the near future.
Cheers,Joe


Would that that were true Joe.

We drove an old Land Rover series 11A around the world from the UK in the 70's with it's underpowered 4 cylinder engine and manual gear box. Did the job but lack of A/C, no dust-proofing and 80 kph top speed it didn't suit Aussie conditions.

Next was a Discovery series one, 3.5 V8 with a ZF4HP22 4 speed auto box. Fast, powerful, comfortable (but too soft), but very thirsty (worse than our Oka in sand dunes). Very easy to drive but skittish on steep slippery surfaces. We used it for a few outback trips around the country and we've still got it actually, but it's been unused for years (replaced by the Oka) because it's too small to live in although it was good towing workhorse.

It's a feint hope but I don't suppose the ZF4HP22 auto box would fit behind a Perkins? Probably not strong enough, and it needs a lot of revs before it cuts in (2000+), something a Perkins doesn't have.

So I fear we are stuck with a manual box until, as is usual, failure requires an upgrade.

David and Janet Ribbans - Oka 148
Oka148 profile here.
Visit our technical and travel blogs: here.
Last Edit: 14 Jun 2013 09:00 by dandjcr.

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14 Jun 2013 10:07 - 14 Jun 2013 10:10 #8 by Outback Jack
Outback Jack replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
I have looked into this a bit lately.

My thoughts is I will be installing a 4l80E, can be had from the States for around 2500 as strenghten unit. This will work behind a Perkins and then when its time to upgrade engine, it will bolt to that as well.

I will use a Nissan Transfer case and Marks adapters

I spoke to Al and he has said that the transmission sits in the same spot with engine conversion.

Just have to find the funds and someone/mechanic willing to do it for me.

Something like this

Extreme Automatics 4L80E Stage 2 Up to 1350HP

Last Edit: 14 Jun 2013 10:10 by Outback Jack.

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16 Jun 2013 05:52 #9 by Peter and Sandra OKA 374
Peter and Sandra OKA 374 replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
I've been running the 4L80E behind the Perky since january 2012.
I wrote the article in the database and the required bits including fitting the Nissan GU transfer case.
I bought a brand new Hummer H1/4wd (heaviest GM version) spec trans here in Oz for $4.5k. I used a Compushift to control it which gives lost of extra's like paddle shift, tow mode and the ability to change shift parameters and torque converter lock up points.
It and the Nissan transfer case totally transform the Oka, much nicer to drive, uses less fuel and now has agreat handbrake to boot.
374's Perky is bog standard apart from the air cleaner mod to get it breathing a bit better, engine & Oka have both done just over 120 k km since new. We've put approx 15k on it since the auto was fitted. The auto allows the Perky to get on boost reaaly well and it pulls like a train right up through the gears, still slows down on hills but nothing like the manual box and by unlocking and locking the torque converter in the lower gears you can split them which makes keeping the engine in its torque band easy. The Hummer spec torque converter works well with the Perky as the peak power and torque figures are at the same rpm as the 6.5 chev V8 diesel. It went really well on its shakedown trip across the Simpson last year with the Oka group and a couple of other Oka owners that have driven it reckon I'm a bastard for letting them have drive ;-)))) Another suggested we swap, wasn't much chance of that happening!!

OKA 374 LT Van, converted to camper/motorhome,
400ah Lithiums, 680w solar, diesel cooking heating and HWS,
Cummins 6BT, Allison 6 speed auto, Nissan transfer.

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16 Jun 2013 05:55 #10 by Peter and Sandra OKA 374
Peter and Sandra OKA 374 replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
I forgot to add that if you were to fit a 4L80E then there are adapters to fit it to a Cummins if you wish to do an engine swap down the track.
I'm also happy to help anyone wishing to do the conversion with any knowledge etc.
Peter

OKA 374 LT Van, converted to camper/motorhome,
400ah Lithiums, 680w solar, diesel cooking heating and HWS,
Cummins 6BT, Allison 6 speed auto, Nissan transfer.

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16 Jun 2013 15:19 #11 by Peter334
Peter334 replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
I was sort of waiting for you Peter James to answer this blog as I new you had one fitted and have read your article on it ,i am going to put and auto into ours 4L80E I have a guy in Melbourne that has a new trans and the Nissan transfer case and all the electric parts, other parts from Pete f. But I cannot find anyone that has the flywheel and adaptor , sometimes the web is so useless at finding things , so help in finding those parts would be great or and supplier cheers peter

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16 Jun 2013 15:43 #12 by Outback Jack
Outback Jack replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
I have run into the same problem.


Cant find the following

Perkins SAE 3 industrial flywheel housing and

Perkins stepped industrial flywheel (used on gensets and pumps)

Havent looked yet for the Trans, Transfer etc.

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16 Jun 2013 17:11 #13 by TH
TH replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
Got a link to that article Peter (James)? I have looked in the tech docs but can't find it.

Cheers, Tony

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16 Jun 2013 18:02 #14 by Outback Jack
Outback Jack replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
The following user(s) said Thank You: TH

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17 Jun 2013 03:31 #15 by Peter334
Peter334 replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
Yes have down loaded that file read it but it dose not name the suppler of the bell, fly wheel , will have to talk to Paul or Peter to see where I can get them or a few .cheers peter

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17 Jun 2013 19:09 #16 by Peter and Sandra OKA 374
Peter and Sandra OKA 374 replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
The parts are available from truck wreckers and tractor places.
I got mine from a truck wrecker in SA on one of our trips, put up with it cluttering the floor in the Oka for several weeks and when I got home found the tractor place in town had one set lying around.
There are three SAE housings to suit the Perky's, one for the 4 cylinder (which we want), one for the six cylinder and one for the V8's ( I didn't know there was a V8 Perky either!). Apparently lots of older trucks have the SAE housings but the flywheels are usually only used on industrial engines. I "think" MF tractors have Perkies, don't quote me though.
The local tractor place had them as a result of buying new replacement engines to put in tractors. It is cheaper to buy a fully dressed industrial engine and swap bits to fit in a tractor than buy a long engine. So they had one set in the yard but admitted they had scrapped heaps over the years. The set I got from them has been sold to another Oka owner.
"The Rock" tractor and truck parts down near Wagga has them but is also a bit expensive.
The flywheel I got had only six bolt holes but was easily drilled to take the extra ones our engines have.

OKA 374 LT Van, converted to camper/motorhome,
400ah Lithiums, 680w solar, diesel cooking heating and HWS,
Cummins 6BT, Allison 6 speed auto, Nissan transfer.

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17 Jun 2013 19:43 #17 by Dave and Pauline Gray
Dave and Pauline Gray replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
Hi jacking the topic here Peter but I owned a truck with a V8 Perkins I bought it new in 1973 and went around the moon a couple of times , it leaked oil from the valley cover, the gearbox was a Turner big brother to the one we have in the Oka but it was a reliable and quite economic unit and 2 years ago I was given another one, engine that is, and toyed with fitting it in the Oka , parts are still available ex UK but expensive the one I had was set at 185hp and they were rated out later to 240.

Cheers Dave

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17 Jun 2013 20:06 #18 by Outback Jack
Outback Jack replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
So far, I have found one possibilty and it is new.

So if anyone can find S/Hand ones it would be good.

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17 Jun 2013 20:16 #19 by Joseph Baz
Joseph Baz replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
Lobo,
Have you tried Wholesale automatics,it may be worth a call
Cheers,Joe

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17 Jun 2013 20:59 #20 by Outback Jack
Outback Jack replied the topic: Autos verse manual trans
Hi Joe,

Thanks for the suggestion, I was talking about the SAE housing and flywheel. I need to search a little harder.

Cheers
Lobo

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