Winch ropes

More
09 Aug 2015 11:52 #1 by Harry
Harry created the topic: Winch ropes
Winch ropes dose anyone have anything to do with Dyneema Synthetic rope .. Now you can buy a 10 mm that has a SWL of 10800 kg Is the Chinese made one as good as the one made in Denmark ?? Dose any one have one , tried it out , with an Oka ..... Food for thought ????

Oka 045 the WIDE Motorhome 6bt cummins 500 watt solar diesel heating gas cooking up grade LSD front and rear diffs to 4:56 from 4:88 . 320 lt fuel 153 lt fresh water in 3 separate tanks 3 house batteries 1 start battery 176 lt upright fridge/freezer Black dog security

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
09 Aug 2015 13:18 - 09 Aug 2015 13:19 #2 by Lang
Lang replied the topic: Winch ropes
Harry

We just came back from Cape York and saw a Landcruiser fully loaded being winched up a near verticle river bank. They were using the "cheap" Dyneema rope. By that I presume it was the Chinese one you are talking about. The blokes doing the winching were extreme 4x4 types and said they would never go back to steel rope. I think if the rope has an Australian Standard rating you should be able to count on that as an indication. They said the only downside was that you have to hold a bit of tension on a no-load rewind to wrap tightly on the drum unlike the heavy wire which tended to drag and wrap tighter until the last few meters - although it also wrapped better with some tension..

I tried real Dyneema on a boat trailer winch and not thinking it through and only requiring 1000kg bought the appropriate strength but it was so thin and light that it got tangled up and you couldn't grip it for a pull by hand - like winching with string.

Lang
Last Edit: 09 Aug 2015 13:19 by Lang.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
09 Aug 2015 14:12 #3 by Peter_n_Margaret
Peter_n_Margaret replied the topic: Winch ropes
I have had Dynema (or some such brand) on my Warn 16.5Ti for over 10 years.
Would not consider steel.
I also carry a 50M extension (different brand).

Cheers, Peter.
OKA196 tinyurl.com/OKA196xtMotorhome
Mob.0428171214

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
09 Aug 2015 15:27 #4 by Alister McBride
Alister McBride replied the topic: Winch ropes
There's a huge difference in strength between good and cheap stuff. I did a lot of research before i bought mine from Master Pull ( www.masterpull.com/ ) in the states (much cheaper than buying rope over here even including shipping!). Some of the cheaper stuff isn't even UV stable which means the bit at the end which holds the coupling can just disintegrate over time. Heaps lighter as well, it actually floats on water. Less splinters in your hands handling it too.
I guess downsides are it gets worn a bit more when towing over rocks etc and yes i found it's more important to wind it on to the drum under load than with steel. But overall so much easier to handle than steel wire rope.

cheers, alister

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
09 Aug 2015 16:24 - 09 Aug 2015 16:35 #5 by Lang
Lang replied the topic: Winch ropes
There is also a huge difference between breaking strength and working load. The ropes are sold by breaking strength. Normal safety factor for non-human and non-shock loads is 6:1. Rescue services rate ropes by a 10:1 factor for man loads and the Scaffold Association rate ropes at 15:1 for man loads (although it will actually lift two OKA's, your 10,000kg rope should only lift 666kg or a platform carrying only 6 burley riggers).

Lang
Last Edit: 09 Aug 2015 16:35 by Lang.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
09 Aug 2015 16:29 - 09 Aug 2015 16:33 #6 by Harry
Harry replied the topic: Winch ropes
Wow thank you for all that I will look into it some more thanks again guys. I looked at it and I think 12 mm is the go

Oka 045 the WIDE Motorhome 6bt cummins 500 watt solar diesel heating gas cooking up grade LSD front and rear diffs to 4:56 from 4:88 . 320 lt fuel 153 lt fresh water in 3 separate tanks 3 house batteries 1 start battery 176 lt upright fridge/freezer Black dog security
Last Edit: 09 Aug 2015 16:33 by Harry.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
09 Aug 2015 16:43 #7 by Peter and Sandra OKA 374
Peter and Sandra OKA 374 replied the topic: Winch ropes
I've had it on my previous 4wd's winch and also on the Oka's winch. The original one was proper Dyneema, the Oka's being on a Chinese winch is probably Chinese too. The Dyneema was used successfully a few times over about ten years, the Oka's has never been used.
One thing to watch is exposure to grit and dirt as it gets into the weave like it does on snatch and tow straps and then abrades the rope internally causing damage.
Most 4wd comp vehicles use it BUT they usually remove the rope from the winch in the mud events so it doesn't get dirty unless it is already intended to be replaced.
I know quite a few 4wder's that also keep the rope inside the vehicle rather than on the winch out in the weather.
The Oka's winch with the rope on it lives in the boot so it can be fitted to either end in a time of need so never gets dirty.

OKA 374 LT Van, converted to camper/motorhome,
400ah Lithiums, 1100w solar, diesel cooking heating and HWS,
Cummins 6BT, Allison 6 speed auto, Nissan transfer.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
09 Aug 2015 17:53 #8 by Peter_n_Margaret
Peter_n_Margaret replied the topic: Winch ropes
I keep the winch (and rope) covered at all times when not being used.


Cheers, Peter.
OKA196 tinyurl.com/OKA196xtMotorhome
Mob.0428171214
Attachments:

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
09 Aug 2015 17:56 #9 by DarrenWebster303
DarrenWebster303 replied the topic: Winch ropes
Exactly as Peter said Harry.

I used it in 4x4 competition years ago, keep it washed, keep it off the rocks, & out of the weather & it will be your best friend.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
21 Aug 2015 15:11 #10 by Harry
Harry replied the topic: Winch ropes
Ok now I have a PTO winch and I will buy 12 mm but how long ???? Is 35 meters long enough and will it fit on the winch drum

Oka 045 the WIDE Motorhome 6bt cummins 500 watt solar diesel heating gas cooking up grade LSD front and rear diffs to 4:56 from 4:88 . 320 lt fuel 153 lt fresh water in 3 separate tanks 3 house batteries 1 start battery 176 lt upright fridge/freezer Black dog security

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
21 Aug 2015 17:04 #11 by Dean and Kaye Howells
Dean and Kaye Howells replied the topic: Winch ropes
Hi Harry, I replaced the steel winch rope on #413 several years ago with Dyeema rope, it cost a bloody fortune then, even bought through my mate through Nobles, the premier rope/sling,etc supplier here in Melbourne it cost me $10 per metre for the equivalent strength (slightly smaller diameter) Dyeema rope. The upside was that I could wind 50 metres onto the drum instead of the original 30 metres and if I was really keen could have snuck another layer on. The benefit here is that with 50 metres of Dyeema rope I can use a snatch block for most pulls doubling the pull strength/lessening the winch load and slowing the overall winching time. Great for amateur winchers as it gives more time to respond to unforseen winching issues and overall safety. :)

Deano :)
The following user(s) said Thank You: Joseph Baz

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
21 Aug 2015 19:21 - 21 Aug 2015 19:23 #12 by Hank Onthewater
Hank Onthewater replied the topic: Winch ropes
Still have 35 mt steel on the drum, but looking to buy 50-100 mt dyneema extension, and that extension will live inside the van, out of the sun and dirt.
Realistically how often has one a tree or something close to enable to get winched out, let alone doubling the rope via a block? 25 to 35 metres? I rather go to 80-100 metres!!

I have used Dyneema on boats extensively. It can hold a mast up replacing normal stainless steel rigging, and on big boats as well!! There are however three issues with Dyneema:
- UV degradation but not really an issue on a winch
- heat, causing by friction or chafe, or on winch, slipping on the drum
- the biggest issue is chafe, either directly by rubbing on something, anything nearly, or by ingrained dirt. BTW, dirt can be easily washed out by putting it in a net bag, and put it in the washing machine. For direct chafe the rope needs to be protected.

Yes, Dyneema from reputable suppliers have a higher breaking strength, and winching is not really a critical use, unlike keeping a $50k mast vertical on a boat. For rigging or lifelines on boats, I have never seen Chinese dyneema (this is an oxymoron, as Dyneema a reg trademark from a Dutch company DSM ) on a boat.

Even Dyneema (in ropes) comes in different grades: SK60, SK75, SK90, DM20 but for winches the cheapest SK60 is OK, but most ropes for sale is the SK75 kind.

Lastly, Dyneema is easy to splice, and even a rope with Dyneema core and polyester sleeve can be spiced relative easily, although the latter is not used in winching situations.

For myself for the boat: I will buy only a reputable brand.
For the OKA I am considering 13 or 14 mm China made, although I could buy the real McCoy SK90 Dyneema 11 or 12 mm at the same strength at more than double the price...... Ouch $26 per metre, but SK75 on special, still $16 p/mt
example here

I have used my winch only once in three years and 35 mt was not long enough then!



Attachments:
Last Edit: 21 Aug 2015 19:23 by Hank Onthewater.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

More
22 Aug 2015 04:50 #13 by PeteFox
PeteFox replied the topic: Winch ropes
Thanks you Hank really informative stuff

Hank Onthewater wrote: Still have 35 mt steel on the drum, but looking to buy 50-100 mt dyneema extension, and that extension will live inside the van, out of the sun and dirt.
Realistically how often has one a tree or something close to enable to get winched out, let alone doubling the rope via a block? 25 to 35 metres? I rather go to 80-100 metres!!
]


However in the east where I am most likely to be, I would likely have more than one tree in the way of getting a straight pull and carry an extra snatch block or two to keep the rope off trees
Pete

Pete Fox OKA266 MultiCab
This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.

www.byles.net/www.oka4wd.com/forum/membe...oka-266?limitstart=0

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Powered by Kunena Forum